Cricket Fans' Forum

Go Back   Cricket Fans' Forum > Cricket Zone > Technical Room
FAQ Members List Calendar Gameroom [0] Arcade CFF Spy Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-01-2012, 09:16 AM
Stuart Stuart is offline
Toothpick
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Armidale, NSW.
Posts: 13,432
Default Cricket Bats and being caught & bowled

I'm not entirely sure how you could do this analysis, but I wonder whether there has been a drop-off in successful caught and bowled dismissals since cricket bats started turning into tree trunks.

In baseball, the major league players must use a bat made of wood rather than aluminum. There are concerns that metal bats hit the ball harder (and therefore faster) and that there is a serious risk of pitchers being either injured or killed by a ball.

Similarly, I wonder if bowlers are now less likely to succeed in catching a straight hit off their bowling, simply because modern bats hit the ball harder than in the past, and therefore get to the bowler faster.

Edit: Please excuse my non-technical use of words such as 'faster' and 'harder'. I recognise that they are probably not accurate in terms of physics. So sue me.
__________________
Quote:
Sorry, off the topic but was wondering how far do midgets in your country go? Here they can go upto 35 or 36 if lucky.

Last edited by Stuart : 08-01-2012 at 09:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-01-2012, 09:55 AM
pappubahry pappubahry is offline
Patzer
 
2D Shootout Champion! 4 Wheel Madness Champion! 42 Games Champion! Addiction Timed Champion! Alphabet Jungle Champion! Aragon Dragon Champion! Astro Cave Champion! Atomyx Champion! Brain Machine Champion! Calculations Champion! Classic Frogger Champion! Color Jumper Champion! Curveball Champion! Doeo Champion! Doof Blocks Champion! Dots Champion! Elf Tetris Champion! Flags Champion! FlashZooids Champion! Gorlog Champion! Helicopter Champion! Hexed Champion! Hexxagon Champion! Jade Shadow Mahjong Champion! James Bomb 2 Champion! Legend of Surf Champion! Mahjong 3D (032) Chrome - The Boat Champion! Mahjong 3D (056) Stone - Bizarre Champion! Mahjong Dark Dimensions Champion! Mahjong Match Champion! Mahjong Solitare Champion! Mahjongg Champion! Mahjongg 3D (027) Chrome - Black Hole Champion! Mahjongg 3D (180) 2 Ways Around - Chrome Champion! Mahjongg 3D (199) Ancient Crab - Chrome Champion! Mahjongg 3D (202) 2 Fish Kissing - Stone Champion! Mahjongg 3D Win XP Tiles Champion! Mahjongg: Alchemy Champion! Mario Tetris 3 Champion! Master Qwan`s Mahjongg Deluxe Champion! Mom-Jongg - Mahjong Champion! Order Champion! Paper Airplane Game Champion! Paranoia Champion! Penguin's Revenge Champion! Pentix Champion! Pingu Breakout Champion! Plupon Champion! Pong Out Champion! Shoot the devil Champion! Snipers Champion! Sonic Champion! Surf Point Blue Champion! Sveny Excuse v32 Champion! Turbocharged Penguins! Champion! Ultimate Formula Racing Champion! Urban Mahjongg Chase Champion! Water Skiing Champion! Wooly Jumper Champion! Word Drop Champion! Yeti Sports 10 - Icicle Climb Champion! Yeti Sports 6 Big Wave Champion! YetiSports 8 - Jungle Swing Champion! Zookeeper Champion! Arcaneoid Champion!
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 11,995
Default

Here is the percentage of wickets that are caught and bowled by decade. The dots are at the start of the decade and include the 1870-79, 1880-89, ..., 2000-09.



There hasn't been much change recently. It is possible that hard-hit shots are harder to catch, but the bowlers get more opportunities. I don't know.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-01-2012, 03:40 PM
Gabe Gabe is offline
Club player
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 151
Default

Trend's a bit clearer for all FC cricket (ignore blob at the end - that's a bin starting 8 days ago...)

Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-01-2012, 03:48 PM
deathspank's Avatar
deathspank deathspank is offline
Never forget the Nakba
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Deir Yassin
Posts: 15,997
Default

Improved batting techniques are a bigger factor than bats.
__________________
Bit of a theme with Poms. Dirt in a pocket, mints in the mouth, spikes into the ball.
---------------
"There once was a fellow named Ponting,
Whose attack was suddenly found wanting,
Though they toiled all day, They failed to make way,
The memories of Warnie must be taunting!"
---------------
"Shane, with your, er, sorry Shane."
An unnamed reporter can't let go of Shane Warne's memory as he starts a question to Stuart MacGill ... who had just reached 200 Test wickets
---------------
"An Australian only walks when his car has run out of petrol." - Ian Healy
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-01-2012, 06:16 PM
fletch's Avatar
fletch fletch is offline
Ratcatcher
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: London
Posts: 34,577
Default

Bat technology has improved significantly. Would never have received the injury below attempting to stop a youth's off drive with my boot off my own bowling in the nets(clearly I missed ) The ball comes off the bat much sweeter, faster and more consistently than even 10 years ago.


http://www.cricketfansforum.net/atta...0&d=1271001277
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-01-2012, 06:40 PM
NYCO's Avatar
NYCO NYCO is offline
Test Legend
 

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 12,960
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe View Post
Trend's a bit clearer for all FC cricket (ignore blob at the end - that's a bin starting 8 days ago...)

I'm not sure you can diagnose from this without seeing what type of dismissal commensurately rose.
__________________
Experience is the name every one gives to their mistakes... -- Oscar Wilde
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09-01-2012, 07:23 PM
Stuart Stuart is offline
Toothpick
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Armidale, NSW.
Posts: 13,432
Default

Thanks to Pappu and Gabe for the graphs.

The part of the analysis that is so hard (which I didn't articulate well in the first post) is whether there are more 'dropped' chances by the bowler because the ball is simply going back faster than they can react. I was wondering whether we were seeing a reduction in successful 'caught and bowleds' due to this factor, but there is no way (that I know of) to get that sort of data (i.e. the number of dropped catches by the bowler per match has increased).

I've been thinking about the above graphs for a day or two, but am still not sure of precisely what they tell us. There is a clear downward trend (in Gabe's anyway), but as GB points out, the reasons for this could be anything from changing pitch conditions, differing techniques, increased fielding aptitude, bats etc. The length of the fall in Gabe's graph would tend to indicate that it is not a recent trend, and would therefore counter the concept that it is related to the improvements in bats. As NYCO says, it would be interesting to see if another type of dismissal has seen an equivalent rise.

Another thought for Pappu and Gabe (who can do the dirty work for me ) - has there been a change over time with respect to the concept that are players more likely to be dismissed 'caught and bowled' on a higher score than caught in other positions? I am wondering here is whether 'C & B' is something than usually happens later in the innings (e.g. when the batsman is trying to increase his scoring rate), regardless of the era.
__________________
Quote:
Sorry, off the topic but was wondering how far do midgets in your country go? Here they can go upto 35 or 36 if lucky.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-01-2012, 07:13 PM
paddyr paddyr is offline
Match Winner
 

Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,703
Default

But hasn't Zaheer made a career from c&b dismissals?
__________________
"Violence breeds violence." Mahatma Gandhi

"Intelligence agencies around the world nauseate each other." A French Diplomat, after WMD was never found in Iraq
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 14-01-2012, 03:32 AM
Fine Leg Fine Leg is offline
Bollocks
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: M13
Posts: 9,579
Default

Like NYCO states, I really don't think the improvement in bats has anything to do with the stats on C&B dismissals as most are from leading edges or from the batsman playing the drive too early and hence not hitting the middle of the bat. This is from my own experience anyway. If you are dismissed C&B playing a full blooded drive then you are just damn unlucky.
__________________
If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.
Aleister Crowley (1875-1947)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 17-02-2012, 05:55 PM
Immiplet
 
Posts: n/a
Default tworzenie stron internetowych kolo

Hello

I am new here, welcome folks .
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-03-2012, 08:37 PM
paddyr paddyr is offline
Match Winner
 

Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,703
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Immiplet View Post
Hello

I am new here, welcome folks .


Welcome. Start posting away, and don't give a damn about anyone else on this site. Especially GMUZ, Affers, and TLD.
__________________
"Violence breeds violence." Mahatma Gandhi

"Intelligence agencies around the world nauseate each other." A French Diplomat, after WMD was never found in Iraq
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-03-2012, 04:27 PM
Affers's Avatar
Affers Affers is offline
SENI0R F0RUM M0DERAT0R
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Corridor of Uncertainty
Posts: 18,142
Default

why not paddy i thought we were friends?
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 100 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 100 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 13-05-2012, 12:32 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

Can I just say that I have a monster of a cricket bat and in my last season I only ever got caught on the boundary- even leading edges nearly went for four. The good bats these days make a huge difference to your survivability at the crease, and I'm sure that that goes for caught and bowled as well. It's just so easy to time the ball with the weight of the bat and the bat speed with the balance..

Last edited by Hammond : 13-05-2012 at 12:32 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 19-05-2012, 03:54 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

By the way this is the very type of bat that I use.. I wouldn't recommend anyone buy one because although they are wonderful only an idiot would pay so much. An idiot like me..

Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 20-05-2012, 12:18 AM
Stuart Stuart is offline
Toothpick
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Armidale, NSW.
Posts: 13,432
Default

Nice - have had a quick play in the nets with one of them before. Great balance. What weight is it?
__________________
Quote:
Sorry, off the topic but was wondering how far do midgets in your country go? Here they can go upto 35 or 36 if lucky.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 20-05-2012, 01:47 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart View Post
Nice - have had a quick play in the nets with one of them before. Great balance. What weight is it?
2'10 with a regular to high middle. 12 super straight grains.

And I hated it when I first used it, only started using it regularly this year- I had always used the other bat that this bat package comes with.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 20-05-2012, 05:43 AM
Stuart Stuart is offline
Toothpick
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Armidale, NSW.
Posts: 13,432
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammond View Post
2'10 with a regular to high middle. 12 super straight grains
Funny thing - I read somewhere recently that the best willow has LESS grains not more (which I agree is completely contrary to what we look for in a blade). Can't remember where though.

Dunno if you remember when Wessels stained the front of his bat so that the grain showed up really clearly, but I thought it looked cool
__________________
Quote:
Sorry, off the topic but was wondering how far do midgets in your country go? Here they can go upto 35 or 36 if lucky.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 20-05-2012, 06:05 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart View Post
Funny thing - I read somewhere recently that the best willow has LESS grains not more (which I agree is completely contrary to what we look for in a blade). Can't remember where though.

Dunno if you remember when Wessels stained the front of his bat so that the grain showed up really clearly, but I thought it looked cool
From what I know, the more grains, the older the tree, and the further the ball will travel off the face as soon as you purchase it. Less grains, younger tree, will take longer to play in but will last longer.

Very rare to find an old tree that will supply bats of 15 grains plus.. but the wood will be softer and it will play like a gun from the start..
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 24-05-2012, 10:33 AM
fletch's Avatar
fletch fletch is offline
Ratcatcher
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: London
Posts: 34,577
Default

You really are quite mad. That is obscene quite frankly. Can you lend us a tenner btw....


http://www.quantumcricket.com/laver.html
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 24-05-2012, 10:43 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

The missus went to Scotland to see her folks- she asked me if I wanted to come but I couldn't get away from work there was a big thing on so I said it would cheaper all round if she just gave me $2K AUS so I could buy a cricket bat.

She agreed. Hence my possession of a Laver & Wood Signature Howitzer
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 24-05-2012, 10:55 AM
fletch's Avatar
fletch fletch is offline
Ratcatcher
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: London
Posts: 34,577
Default

You're still quite mad.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 24-05-2012, 11:06 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fletch View Post
You're still quite mad.
I know. But nice things cost money (Schindlers list) and you know where the money went when you see the ball actually accelerate after it pierces the field, or the confidence you feel when you pick one up outside off stump and watch it bounce once before hitting the mid wicket fence.

The bat is fucking incredible. I didn't like it at first but that is because I am a moron.

An example of the bats amazing power..

http://mycricket.cricket.com.au/comm...atchID=1138811

Last edited by Hammond : 24-05-2012 at 11:09 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 24-05-2012, 11:25 AM
fletch's Avatar
fletch fletch is offline
Ratcatcher
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: London
Posts: 34,577
Default

What you do with your dosh is your business, but I really can't see how it would be significantly better than, for instance a 200 quid newbery or equivalent, particularly for a club player. Pretty sure even the big boys don't use bats priced over 600 squids. Your bat package is more expensive than my shitty car. Whatever floats your boat though.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 24-05-2012, 11:29 AM
Hammond Hammond is offline
Club captain
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fletch View Post
What you do with your dosh is your business, but I really can't see how it would be significantly better than, for instance a 200 quid newbery or equivalent, particularly for a club player. Pretty sure even the big boys don't use bats priced over 600 squids. Your bat package is more expensive than my shitty car. Whatever floats your boat though.
Umm. I have a $700 Professional grade Millichamp and it only travels maybe two thirds of the way with the same shot as that Laver.

Honestly the thing is ridiculous. I pity the bowlers (a bit)..

I do love Salix though. I can assure you that the signature bat is not a gimmick. It's true test quality.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:30 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.